An Honest Conversation About Prayer

In this episode of the Going Deeper podcast, I’m joined by my friend Bethany for a heartfelt conversation about prayer—especially in the thick of motherhood. Bethany shares her journey to faith and how her prayer life has grown and changed over the years. We talk honestly about the struggle to stay connected to God when life feels loud and overwhelming, and how prayer doesn’t have to be formal or perfect—it can simply be a real, ongoing conversation with the Lord. We also reflect on the power of praying in community, the legacy our prayers leave for our children, and how vulnerability with God is where intimacy begins. Whether you feel confident in your prayer life or completely scattered, I hope this episode reminds you that God just wants your heart—and He’s always ready to listen.

Timestamps: 

00:00 - Introduction and Icebreakers
05:39 - Bethany's Journey of Faith and Prayer
11:19 - The Impact of Motherhood on Prayer Life
16:47 - The Power of Prayer and Generational Impact
21:07 - Overcoming Technical Challenges in Prayer Conversations
21:11 - The Importance of Prayer in Times of Need
22:05 - Maturity in Prayer: Developing a Habit
23:25 - The Modern Church's Struggle with Prayer
24:43 - Recognizing Spiritual Warfare in Daily Life
24:59 - Finding Rhythms of Prayer in Chaos
28:22 - The Simplicity of Prayer: A Relationship, Not a Ritual
30:56 - Making Space for Prayer Amid Distractions
34:39 - The Power of Prayer: Personal Testimonies
41:59 - Encouragement for Developing a Prayer Life
44:19 - The Transformative Power of Prayer in Our Lives

Tags:

prayer, motherhood, faith, spiritual growth, community, intimacy with God, overcoming shame, prayer life, personal testimony, encouragement

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Hey guys, welcome back to the Going Deeper podcast. This is now take seven. No, I'm just kidding. I have one of my closest friends with me, Bethany. It's just fitting that we're messing up left and right. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast today. Yes, thank you so much for having me. I said you're welcome previously. I'm not going to say you're welcome again. So I wanted to have Bethany on the podcast for a few reasons. One, obvious, we're good friends. We have spiritual conversations and I always grow from them. But you also– we talk about prayer a lot, and it's an area that I feel you are strong in in our relationship. I know I have people in my friend group who I would say they're stronger in prayer than I would, or maybe it comes more naturally. So I knew that that was something that I wanted to have you on to talk about. But also, we spoke at Mops on prayer, and I remember asking you, hey, could we– Do the same talk, but on the podcast. So yeah, thank you again for coming on. So just for those that don't know you, share a little bit about who you are. Yes, yes. So I'm from Brandenburg, Kentucky. Now I live in Elizabethtown, Kentucky. I've been a Christian for almost 10 years now. And I've been married for almost seven. And we have three children together who are four, almost three, and a little over one. And I love to bake. I love to read. I love food. I love eating food with friends and family, getting time with friends and having spiritual conversation. Yeah. I can relate to all the food and spiritual conversation. Well, yeah. For people so that they can get to know you a little bit better. I did this with Lauren. We're going to do a rapid fire icebreaker questions. I've got about 10 of them. And I picked these because I didn't necessarily know the answer to all of these. We're just going to pump them out. Are you ready? I think so. Okay. What's your go-to coffee or tea order? Okay. I love both. But I would say I really like from Vibe. here in town or from Starbucks, I would do like a shaken espresso, like a brown sugar, anything brown sugar, typically half caffeine. Yeah. Yeah. Half caffeine for sure. Okay. Introvert, extrovert, or ambivert? I would say extrovert. Yeah. I would say extrovert. Yeah. I think so. Most of the time. Yeah. What's your favorite way to spend a slow Saturday? What's a slow Saturday with kids? I'm into that. I'm into that. Slow Saturday. I would say coffee, probably from Vibe. Farmer's Market. Hanging out outside with my family. That sounds like an ideal Saturday. You are a true homebody, but not in a bad way. I am, yes. I do love being home. Yes. Okay, so if you had to eat one meal for the rest of your life, what would it be? Oh, sheet pan fajitas. with rice and beans. Delicious. Yeah. You turned me onto that too. And it's so funny. Cause I, uh, I was like, I say I was raised Mexican. That doesn't even make any sense. But my pop, who's my grandfather, was full-blooded Mexican, so I was raised up on Mexican food. And I never did sheet pan fajitas in my life. I always did them on the stove. I know. Once you do it, you'll never go back. Yeah, it's life-changing. Life-changing. Okay, so what's your current favorite worship song? Hmm. I love Brandon Lake. I'm going to his concert next month. My husband, we're really excited about that. But any of his songs, I mean, Hard Fought Hallelujah, such a good one. It's a great one. Praise. I would say those two are on repeat. That'll be a really good concert. It will be great. I'm excited. I'm jealous. Okay, so what's a small thing that brings you joy lately? Keeping my flowers alive on my porch. Oh, me too. Go us. I'm sorry. I pretty much just wait for them to get droopy. And then I'm like, Oh, they need a little water. I don't even know what kind they are. I couldn't tell you what they are. Okay, cool. The lady just told me at the store that they were resilient. So, um, the low maintenance flowers. Yeah. One thing you're learning about yourself right now. I'm constantly learning scenarios in my life. If I'm being totally honest. Amen. Yeah. We'll get into that. It's not a very fun answer, but that's the truth. We'll be getting into that. Okay. Dream vacation destination. I would love to go to Hawaii. I'm such a beach gal. Are you willing to do the flight though? The 13 hours? I just don't think so. 13 hours. That's just insanity. I mean, I think it's 13 hours to get anywhere. Truly.

UNKNOWN: 4:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 4:57

I don't know actually though. Hawaii. I would totally go to Hawaii. Okay. And the last one is one word your friends would use to describe you. I don't know. You tell me. I know my word. I know my word for myself. Forgetful. 100%. Forgetful. Okay. I don't know. I would not use that word to describe you. I would say intentional. That's what I would say. Thank you. Thoughtful. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. I would agree with that. At my best, I can be. Yes, for sure. Okay. So kind of like I said, I reached out to you about coming on the podcast and I kind of put it out there. Like we could literally talk about anything because we do love spiritual conversations, but you definitely were like, I do feel like prayer. You wanted to talk about prayer. And I was like, yeah, let's do it. I think that that is one. I don't think I've talked about prayer in this podcast in depth. So yeah, That is a good thing. But we've had plenty of conversations about it. You and I, another friend, Mallory, and I think every time I grow in some capacity. So now we're just going to record them. What would you say your journey with prayer has looked like over the years? Because you came to faith. Oh, you know what? I want to just, I would love for you to just briefly give a little bit of insight into how you came to faith, because I do think that it's unique. And I love it. I love your testimony. Sure. It is such a unique story. So really only through the Lord that I was placed in relationship with a wonderful lady at, whenever I was at Bowling Green at Western Kentucky University, and her name was Natalie. And there's no other way to say it than it was through the Lord. I was, I just ended up in her van one day. I love that. Grace of God. And yes. And, um, she had me over to her house a week later and she shared the gospel with me at her kitchen table. And I saw what her family had and it was something very different that I'd never seen before. And it was almost like I could reach out and grab it. It was such an, a tangible way of just the way that they lived set apart from the world. And, um, I became a believer right in her kitchen. Wow. I just love that story. I love it. I don't think you hear often nowadays stories of people who were preached the gospel like in America and then came to faith. Yes. Especially not on a college campus in somebody's house. Right. I love that. So thinking from... then to now, what's your journey of prayer looked like? Well, I would say I've always had a prayer life, and especially as a new believer, I did. However, I think once I became a mom, that's when I really grew in prayer because I really needed the Lord. And I think since becoming a mom, and it's almost as if I can see with each baby that I've been revealed more sin And it's been such a sanctifying journey, motherhood has, that I've seen my selfishness and just really seen my sin so heavily and seen areas that I've really needed the Lord. I think He's just really shown me my need for Him since becoming a mom. And there's been seasons of motherhood that have been harder than others, but it's in my face all day, just how much I really need Him. So would you say that when you were like a new believer prior to being a mom, you Would you say that your prayer, like your discipline of prayer was maybe more out of like obligation or something you felt like you needed to do? I think it was more, I think it was more like whenever I felt like I was struggling with something or I would bring my asks to him. Now it's more like a constant conversation is what I would say. And that there was a huge shift. And I think I felt like I had a lot of control before I was a mom and I was walking with him, but I thought I had it all together. Yeah. Yeah. with each baby. So I think I just need to keep having babies so I can. That's the way you're going to become perfect, which is having 10 kids. These women with 10 kids. Yeah, they must be. I love that. It is very true. And you and I have had many conversations and you and Mallory have talked about this and pretty much anybody that I know that I do life with as a mom is like, man, this is really hard and I kind of suck at it sometimes. And I don't know how people do it without having a relationship with God in some ways. I would say too that I think the dependency aspect is definitely a huge shift for me when I think about the difference between not having kids and having kids was like to your point, I thought I had things figured out or that I was like, not even in control of my life, but like I had it down. I knew what I was doing. You know, I felt comfortable. And then kids. Yeah. They just wreck everything. Comfort. It's just, you trade comfort for chaos. Yes. Beautiful. Yes. And I think that it does make you not all the time, but it definitely brings you to a place where you're like, okay, well, I am stripped bare, and everything ugly is now brought to light. Yes. And I think I've had more prayers of repentance than I ever expected to going into motherhood. Yes. So would you say there's a moment or a season that really shifted everything for you, besides becoming a mom, maybe in motherhood, for your prayer life?

UNKNOWN: 11:18

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00: 11:19

I would say that there's definitely a season that sticks out to me that grew my prayer life in a significant way. And it was this past year. It was just a really hard season with health challenges surrounding one of my children. And I wrestled a lot with God throughout that season. And I would pray by her door every night once the whole house was asleep. And During this time, I felt like I just really experienced God in a different way. And I wouldn't even say it was because of the way He answered my prayers, because they were not in the way that I was asking. And things did not look like I wanted them to. But during that season, I really grew in my prayer life. I changed the way that I prayed. And I did see God move in my life. Again, even if it wasn't how I expected or wanted it to be, I felt like I got to know Him in that season in a way that I never had before. And would you say that that was almost the work, that was His plan all along? Yes. Isn't that how it always happens? Yes. It's like what you were praying for was the circumstantial change, right? And while you're praying for that, he's changing you. Yes. Yeah. Yes. I do feel like that. Jackie Hill Perry said the other day, I think I had listened to one of her podcasts and she had said like, you're praying for God to move the mountain, but maybe you're the mountain. Oh, wow. Yes. Can relate to that. Very much relate to that. I love when you said that you prayed by her door. So this makes me think about, to be fully transparent, it makes me think about a conviction that I've had. And maybe it's not a conviction. Maybe it's just a holy desire that I have that I've really struggled to like implement. And that's just praying for my kids every single day. I'll be nursing Tatum and I'll be putting her to bed at night and I'll think, I haven't prayed for my kids once today. And it is a sense of conviction. And it's not because I feel that's what I have to do, but it's an opportunity. And you talked about this. I would love for you to go into it, just about the idea of the generational impact that we have when we prioritize praying for our kids. Do you mind talking about that? Sure. So I think it is such a bizarre thought to think the prayers that we're praying now, we may not even see them come to fruition. But the prayers that we're praying now could be affecting our family for generations to come. And just how a prayer that we're praying now for our child could be affected in their grandchild that we may never see. We may never see the fruit of that here. But I do. I mean, I try to remember to pray for my kids' spouses if that's what the Lord has for them in marriage. When I can remember to be thoughtful to pray for that. Yeah. I would love to get to share that with their spouses one day when I meet them. Like, I've been praying for you, and I'm trusting the Lord that when I do meet them, if they do get married and I do meet their spouse, that I'll feel some peace to know that this is the person that I was praying for. So I think of that one often, praying for your children's spouses, because prayerfully they'll spend a lot more time with their spouse than they will in our home. So we should be praying for that. It's very true. And it's funny because I don't, for whatever reason, I never think about that. Well, it's not only in front of us. So many other things, you know? Yes. But yeah, I have been feeling like, is it, is it like what needs to happen for me to get to a place where I'm like, because I do, like you said, you know, I, I try to be in constant conversation with the Lord throughout the day. And, but it's not often that I'm thinking to myself that, unless I'm sitting down and I've got my journal open, which I haven't been journaling as much lately as I normally do, which is typically when I pray more intentionally, but I'm thinking to myself, what is it going to take for me to be more intentional with praying for my kids? But I, because I don't want to go, I don't want to go, you know, through the younger years and think, man, I really wish I would have, because I know the power that it has. For sure. Right. Yeah. Right. And I think too, I mean, And this is not every day, but if we could start our day in silence and solitude and sit and ask the Lord, what should we pray for? I think the times I do that, I go in a completely different direction than I would have thought. Or I feel like, okay, you're asking me to pray for that. I didn't think that that was where my focus would be this morning. Instead of just starting off with our requests. When we first started that, there are people in my life who I feel have a stronger prayer life or that it comes more naturally for them. And that's definitely true for you. I think that in our friendship, we've been able to sort of balance each other out, if that's the right word. I would say that I'm definitely somebody who's way more nerdy, more interested in like studying. And I want to know, I want to know a lot of things. And it, It sometimes can come out of bad motives, but I do feel like it's just the way that I want to relate to the Lord or that sort of my way that I connect with Him. Whereas I know you've shared that you do feel like prayer has been at the forefront of your intimacy with the Lord. Would you say that that's true? I think so, yes. But I also think it can be learned, right? I mean, the disciples asked Jesus, teach us how to pray. Teach us how we should pray. Right. So I do think that it, it came more natural to me. Yes. When I was a new believer and not sure what the reason for that was. Um, but I think it was just so excited that I had access to him all the time. Oh, cause I think it felt really like religion to me. Um, and he didn't feel like an approachable God. And so I think once, once I did really come to know him, um, It did. It felt like a gift of like, I can just have this conversation anytime I want with the creator of the universe that loves me. Wow. And I don't always operate out of that, right? I don't always operate out of that. And I don't always remember that. But it does come more natural, I think. But I have grown over the years. I don't think I would have been comfortable to pray out loud or even pray for a close friend. on the phone where now it's like, I just believe in prayer so much. I'm not worried about how I sound, you know? Yes. Amen to that. And I do think, and I think we talked about this briefly when we discussed this at Mops, but I think that until you give prayer a shot and until you see the Lord move in your life in a mighty way, you almost won't have that, a motivation or incentive in a sense to pray. Yeah. Because you don't realize what power He has to move. Sure. Sure. Yes. Yes. And lots of my prayers now, the more that I'm learning about God and the more I read His Word, I just want to be more like you. And I've got so far to go. That's how we're going to get there. It's reading His Word and being in prayer and conversation with Him. Yeah. Have... In the 10 years that you've been walking with the Lord, has there been times where you felt like your prayer life was really dry or maybe really hard? And how did you overcome that? Yes, multiple times. I think there's been multiple seasons where it felt dry and vulnerable answer here. But I think what's kept me in those seasons from going to the Lord has been shame. And it's been a lot of, yes, it's been a lot of like, why am I still dealing with the same sin of anger or selfishness? A lot of selfishness. And I just feel like I started back small, like, Lord, I'm going to sit at your feet. You already know how I feel. Wow. Show me your kindness in a tangible way. You know, say that because I would say, I think if everybody listening is If I were to ask like in my seasons of times when I feel that my prayer life is dry, what are the reasons for it? I wouldn't answer shame, which is interesting. This is what's so interesting about all of us is we're all so different. I think for me, it would probably be pride. Sure. A hundred percent. It would be pride. And I even was thinking about this into preparation for today's episode, but I think that I cheapen God's grace and, A lot of times because I think it's almost like I got it, you know, almost like I try to operate out of my own will and strength. Yes. And then I hit a wall. I'm like, I guess I should have included God in that. Yes. I've struggled with that too. Yeah. I mean, so many times like that desire to control and thinking that this is on me, not even necessarily that I think I can do it better. I mean, we're saying that when we don't go to him and we're struggling with control. Right. But I think in my mind, I think like specifically with my kids, I've got to figure this thing out. Like I've got to do the research. I've got to talk to the people. I've got to get the resources. I've got to do this. There we go. Well, we're just going to jump right back in because this Satan isn't not going to win. We're just, yeah, he's not going to win tonight. Y'all for it's we, I don't know how I'm going to edit this, but. I don't understand. Your phone died when it's plugged in. That's freaking the enemy. It's plugged in. It's plugged in. It's the enemy. He doesn't want us talking about prayer. So we're going to dive in. Do you remember what you were going to say when I was talking about the water and the rock? Or do we want to just go to the next question? Yes, I do. I think this is part of the question. I think a couple reasons came to mind of why maybe we don't go to prayer as our instinct when we're in need. We're always in need, but when there's an immediate need. And I would say... We lack trust in God and what He will do. And that goes back to the control thing you were saying. I think where we could be struggling with something and we think, well, I just need to do better. I just need to not struggle with that thing anymore. Or my kid is struggling with something, so I'm just going to try to control the situation the best I can. Instead of just pausing and saying, Holy Spirit, help me. I think we do live in such a rushed day-to-day in this world. Yeah, I think that's spot on, even when I think about the times that I'm struggling in the day, where if I reflect back, I'm like, I didn't even go to the Lord for that. I didn't even come to my mind to go to the Lord for that. Sure. And I do think that that is what maturity looks like, is getting into more of a habit where it is an instinct to pause. Yes. Yes. Go to the Lord. Even with the simple things that we don't think are that important. Yes. Yeah. All part of the sanctification process. Well, and I wanted to, I had, yeah, we read this, uh, praying like monks living like fools. And when I knew we were going to talk about prayer, I was kind of looking through some of the areas that I highlighted. And this is such a solid book. I'd recommend it to anybody, but I saw this one in the end towards the end. And I was like, Ooh, that quote is so good. So I'm going to read it. And then, You just, whatever comes to mind, we can chat about it. I think this is in the chapter, Raise Up the Tabernacle of David. And this is by Tyler Statt. And he says, but the modern church's best kept secret is this. We believe in productivity, not prayer. We believe in solid programs, above average teaching, and yet another worship album release. That's success, right? The church's underground atheism in our time is that we will busy ourselves with almost anything except prayer. That's good. So true. That's good. So true. It is, and I think it also reminds me where we were just talking about. We do have an enemy that is out to kill, steal, and destroy, and he wants us to think that it's all on us. And that takes away prayer. That takes away the need for God. If we've got it figured out, if we're on God. And we forget that he's like prowling around like a lion seeking to devour. Yes. And I've noticed in the times in my life where I feel like there's been an awakening or I've become aware of a new sin that I want to grow in, that I feel a lot of attacks and a lot of distractions, which of course makes a little sense. So you're a mom, three kids, three under four. Yes. Three under four, which you've had way, way more back to back than any of us. And our life is chaos more often than it is not. And I think it could be really easy for us, whether it's a mom or Or it's just somebody with a really busy schedule because it seems like everybody is busy nowadays because that's even what the book talked about. But what would you say are your rhythms of prayer as somebody who is in the chaos of raising littles? So I almost always get up early. My mom kind of set that example for me. And I am someone that I really love to have time with. of solitude in my house before my kids are up. And I'm just so needy of that time that I do. I sacrifice sleep at times to get that. So first thing in the morning, that would be my ideal morning, is to just sit in prayer with God. And that's my focus time of prayer, I would say, is every morning and then at nap time. And then every day may look different. um, in the season of raising little kids, but I'm a stay at home mom. I'm home with my kids and we do get out of the house a lot. I would say on the mornings that we're home, it's, we pray at breakfast and I do pray honestly for myself in front of them so that they can see me pray in that way. Um, and that they can see me struggle and need the Lord. And I hope to continue to do that. But if we're going somewhere, it's in the car, we always pray in the car and, I'll use that time to let them know things that I'm struggling with, like I said, but also use it as a way to kind of set the expectation for them of this is where we're going and discussing sharing with other kids if we're going to a play date, praying for the families that we're going to see, praying for my husband that's at work, their dad. And those are the same rhythms every day, I would say. And then... feeding the baby at night or whenever it's quiet, because most of the time if I'm nursing, it's loud with the other kids around. But there are times when I'm doing audio messages with friends, but I will sometimes use that time as well to pray. So that's a normal day to day. But I do think a lot of a lot of my prayer life is the conversation as well. It's just the constant conversation throughout the day. So if I'm doing dishes or doing laundry, um, if there's just a little bit of a lull or if it's a time of need, then those come up as well every day. Yeah. I love that. And would you say that when you're having that set aside intentional time, are you doing it with like a Bible open? I know you're not a big journaler or do you truly just like sit before the Lord. Sure. Yeah. I'm not a journaler. Maybe I will be in another season. I'm not. I know you are. I love that. I want to, I want to be, I am just not. So I'm not a big prayer journaler. I was early in my walk, but I'm not right now. But I do pray with my Bible open first thing in the morning. Yes. And then throughout the day, typically, no, it is just, it's just me and God. Sometimes eyes open, sometimes eyes closed, sometimes on my knees in certain seasons. But yeah, Yes, just having that posture of I can have this relationship anywhere. It doesn't have to look a certain way. So yes, that's the way I would describe it. I think that we all need to have that freedom of, I know it's so cliche to say that it's a relationship. It's not a religion, even though I know Jen Wilkin would argue like, no, it's a religion as well. But I think that we get a lot of times caught up and the logistics. I know I do, or I'll overcomplicate things because I overcomplicate everything. And prayer is just not one of those things that needs to be overcomplicated. I think if anything, it's the spiritual discipline that should be the most ease. That should, you know, when Jesus says like, my, my yoke is easy and my burden is light. I feel like prayer should be one of those things where it's like, okay, you know, I think when we can get to that place where it's like, it's not about, It's about being, yeah. Yes. And not letting that hold you back because there isn't a specific way to pray. I mean, we talked about this in our mops talk, but there, there's a model of prayer that was, right. And Matthew, however, I think there's no bad prayer. Even if we come to the Lord and we feel that was very egocentric or we're coming and he's going to honor that we're coming to him. Amen. That was our desire to come to Him. to change something. It wasn't this, you know, beautiful Psalm that went through the adoration, confession, Thanksgiving and supplication model. You know, it was just, I need God and I know he can change me in the situation. Yeah. Prayer can be simple. Yes. Yes. Yes. Like I love the expert model. It's a wonderful model. It doesn't have to look like that every time. A prayer can simply be tears. You sitting with God saying, I'm allotting this time with you. Remove any distractions. I'm sitting with you. Right. Well, and I think we can pray about our desire to pray and then we can pray to have more time to pray. Yes. He honors all of that. So speaking of distraction, what are some ways that you've tried to make space and make room for prayer in the season? Would you say that just the waking up early? What about your phone? Any distractions? That's what I was going to say. Yes. I think the number one thing I would say is leaving your phone, being intentional to leave your phone, even today. Perfect example, I had all three of my kids outside playing this afternoon, and my phone was laying on the bar in the kitchen, and I was kind of coming in and out of the house. I had had dinner going and was going out of the house and coming back and forth, and I got dinner in a good spot, and I was going to go sit outside and watch my kids play. And I shut the door to the house and walked back in to grab my phone, but intentionally I made a choice not to, and I thought... I'm going to leave my phone, but on my phone, I'm just going to watch them play. I'm just going to pray. I'm just going to talk to God while I watch them play. And I think we have to make choices like that, because if we don't, we're going to get sucked into our phone. And it could be a good thing having spiritual conversation with a friend. And that's wonderful, but nothing's going to be more important than prayer. And I think our phones are such a distraction. And I used to leave my phone whenever I would like nurse baby in the middle of the night because I wanted to pray and I had to be intentional to leave my phone so that I had nothing else in my hands and to keep me awake. We'll escape to it. I think it's an escape for a lot of people. It's an escape. Yeah. I think a lot of times, especially like if we don't want to face God, like when you were talking about shame, it's like, okay, I just don't want to face this right now. So I'm just going to, Doom scroll. And I'm guilty of that. We're all guilty of doing that. But I think that if we practice enough and have the discipline enough to say, okay, all I'm doing right now is trying to numb out on my phone and I'm intentionally doing that. And why am I doing that? Am I ashamed? Am I just being lazy? Is there something that I'm not trusting the Lord in? Yes. Am I not wanting to come clean about some sin? You know, like, what is it? And just kind of trying to dig a little bit deeper there. Yeah, I would also echo the distractions with the phone thing. I think, honestly, I think I joked about this in the mobs meeting, but sometimes the Holy Spirit will be like, Justine, don't take that phone into the toilet. You can pray on the toilet, you know? Leave your phone when you're going to the bathroom or leave your phone when you're going to nurse. Leave your phone. Yes, absolutely. And talk to him anywhere and go anywhere. That five minutes can be spent. Okay. So do you, cause we talked about the power of prayer and sort of just when you, when you give prayer a shot, I'll use that verbiage, but when you really start to lean on the Lord and, And you start to offer up the things that are going on in your life and you come to him in faith. Cause I think that that's absolutely key, especially if we look at the gospels, but when we come to him in faith and it's not this like prosperity gospel of like, Oh Lord, I expect this answer, but an expectation that he is going to answer and that his answer is for our good and his glory. But, Do you have any stories of like the power of prayer where you prayed and you were just like, whoa, that was the Lord? Yes. Yes. I mean, as I mentioned, my daughter that really struggled this past year with some health challenges, and I'll be honest, there's still challenges and things don't look like I would like for them to and how I've prayed for them to go. However, I know that God has worked mightily in both of our lives and um, throughout this, our whole family, our whole family's lives throughout this year. Um, yes, I know that God was loud in answering prayers throughout this past year and one in particular. So I shared that I would pray by her door regularly at night and I would have scripture. Like I would have one verse most of the time that I would just take with me and just meditate on. And, um, It was a really desperate time. I was very desperate. You know that. You know that. You walked through that with me. And I was constantly praying for healing. And I was also just praying for answers. Like we didn't know why my daughter was struggling. And she was very miserable lots of times. She couldn't do normal things that other kids could do. You witnessed that at a play date before. And it was heartbreaking. It was really hard for me to watch. And there were... plenty of times where I would pray alone or Aaron and I would pray together, but I, I would ask people to pray, but there was never really a time that I can think of, um, like a group of people praying for my daughter. However, my mother-in-law who she is absolutely a prayer warrior. She came to me and said, you know, I have two friends that, um, we would really love to come over and pray. They know the Lord, and they really believe in the power of prayer. And my first instinct was, oh, I mean, sure. But then I really thought about it, and I thought, who am I to hold them back from that and say no to that? They're willing to give up their time. They love the Lord enough to come to a random girl's house to pray for her daughter. Like, that's beautiful. And, um, we, they did. So they came over and, uh, we prayed for complete and total healing. We prayed for answers right on our bedroom floor, um, with the door shut. And it was almost as if a few, maybe not even weeks shortly after it was just as if her condition really changed and had not made any changes physically, um, We'd made changes for 10 months, diet changes. We've seen several doctors, different supplements, several things, environmental changes. But at that time, we had not. We were kind of at a standstill. Things were kind of at a standstill. We weren't really making any other changes. And I feel like I finally got to this place where it's still a struggle. I will not say that I have it down pat, trusting the Lord fully. But I think at that time, I really... trusted that he was going to show up. And I believed in the power of prayer. And I think for the first time after they left, I even prayed, even if you don't remove this fully, show me that you're using this in her life. And I think I started to trust him from that point. And her life does look a lot different. Her condition is completely different than she was a year ago. night and day difference. And I know that that was through the Lord. I know that wasn't our doing. I know that. And he revealed things to us throughout that time that we were asking for answers on and just put the right people on our path throughout that time. Yeah, for sure. There's so many walking through that with you as an outsider. I do feel like there were multiple times where, um, You would be at the end of your rope. You would be completely desperate or she would be completely desperate, of course. And you would just, and it would be a very specific request, but it was almost always, I just, it was almost like, just open another door. Just give us an answer that's going to lead to her healing. And it did feel like as an outsider within a week of coming to like a desperation point, praying, a door would be opened and then you would kind of have a glimpse of an answer and then you'd get another glimpse of an answer and another glimpse of an answer. And I know that it was like a slow grueling process, but I think the refining that happened was what, who was it? I think somebody said, God is more concerned with building our character than changing our circumstances. And that stuck with me. So true. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. But I can truly say now it's, it's hard to say I wouldn't change a thing because it involved my child suffering. Um, but I do believe that that's going to be part of her testimony. If she comes to know the Lord, it's certainly been part of my walk. Um, yeah, but I learned a lot and I think I would do a lot of things differently. Um, the next time that our family, because we will the next time that our family faces a Valley, I, um, Really pray that I do it differently and that I can trust God in a better way and deeper than I did. Well, and one thing that I would say to somebody listening as an encouragement that I feel like I often pray for, and he always answers when I'm in a valley or I'm having a really hard day, or I will just pray for him to reveal his nearness. I'll just ask like, Lord, just show me that you're near. Just show me that. You are here with me. Because I do struggle with that. I know all throughout scripture, it says, fear not for I'm with you. I mean, that's just, that's like the MO of God is I'm with you. But it's hard when he is not a physical embodied human being that lives in your house, you know? So I pray often, almost, it's almost like I have this belief of, I can just get through anything if I just know God. that you're right here. And I know that, that I know that you're right here. You know what I'm saying? And so I pray for him and he always, he always does. It's always through like a song or a word from somebody or something where I'll be like, okay, God, you're here, you know? And it's almost like the little breadcrumbs that are more powerful. Yes. The big answers. Yes, absolutely. I can relate to that so much. Yeah. A couple final questions. For somebody who's listening and is like, man, I really want a more intimate prayer life, but maybe feels overwhelmed or maybe they overcomplicate it or struggles with shame or whatever. What would you encourage them to do on as far as like where to begin? A couple of things come to mind. I think first, really wrestling with, do you believe? God is who He says He is. And I think if we can start there, it needs to be paired with being in the Word, of course. And the more we learn about God, the more we're going to want to come to Him. We can't trust a God that we don't know. So I would say it's starting there for sure, but also just starting really small of... starting the prayer life, starting the conversation as you would with anyone. You're not going to grow with anyone if you don't know them and if you don't make time for them. So I would say starting out really, really small. And I would say starting early in the morning. I know God modeled that for us, right? Jesus modeled that for us before all the distractions begin, because it will become more of a habit the more you do it. And it will become More of your second nature. Yeah. But I would say being honest with him and saying, using the prayer model. I think that's a great model to use, the Acts prayer model. And being very open and honest. He already knows. He already knows anything that you would share. But opening up to him and asking, help me with this. This doesn't feel natural. Yeah. And he will. I agree. He will. Yep. I would even add, like you just said, like pray for the desire, the capacity to pray, pray for an interest in prayer. I almost think that the prayers that somebody prayed over me 10 years ago and the praise that Justine prayed at 22 to know God more are still being worked out, you know? So praying now, Anytime you struggle with prayer. Yes. Just being honest about it. The last question is, how would you say that your prayer life has changed you or shaped you? And how do you hope it will shape you and change you in the future? I think prayer has sharpened my mind as a believer. And I think... What the Lord will forever sanctify me in is self-forgetfulness. And I think prayer takes our eyes off of ourselves. Lots of times we could be praying about our own circumstances. But, yeah, it's like taking that pressure off. And those are things that I definitely struggle with, like being a performer and wanting to do things really well. And I just know I can't. I know that I'm unable to do anything without Him. And I can just so clearly see that in my life, that the Lord is shaping me in that way of, this life isn't about me, it's about Him. And that's my purpose here, is to glorify Him. And how can I do that each day? I love that. And I love that, you know, that's what I was going to say. When you talked about your first recommendation was to ask yourself, do you truly believe? that God is who he says he is, that he's the God who can, you know, turn water into wine or, you know, all the things that happened throughout history and throughout scripture and that he is real, you know, and that he is present with us. Do we really believe all of those things that we preach or that we hear about on a Sunday morning or that we read about in the Bible? Because I do think that it changes everything. And that's why I think the Acts prayer model is, you know, you start with realizing who you're talking to, you know, because it does make you, you have a more humility, you know, okay, I'm small. Absolutely. And I think at the end of our life, I know one of my biggest regrets, regrets, I'm sure will be that I didn't spend enough time in prayer and I didn't share about him enough. Those are the things that are going to matter at the end of our lives. And if we really, really, truly believe, why would we not be in constant conversation with Him? Yeah, and I love... I was listening to a podcast a while back, and they were talking about prayer as... a way to partner with God. It's a way to partner with God in bringing his kingdom down to earth. And I love that description. I can't remember who talked about it, but just like the idea that we have the power. Well, we don't have the power, but we have the power to make the choice to be obedient, to partner with a God, a really all-powerful God who can do anything. Yes. We have that opportunity literally every day. Yes. Yes. And to show that to our kids. Oh, yeah, that's a great place to close. I would love to close on that because I'm sure that a lot of people listening are moms, and I would never want anybody to feel maybe ashamed that they're not praying enough, even though you and I have just voiced that we feel like we could be praying more. We could always pray more. But I think for me personally, I find encouragement and hope knowing that even though I will fail and that I do fail, that I have the opportunity to model to them that I am not enough and that I do need Jesus and that I'm going to have to ask for his help every day. Yes. Yes. Yes, our kids don't need us to be perfect. They need to see us need God. Yeah, amen. They do. And to see us enjoy God. Oh, yeah. We just listened to the podcast, Frances Chan, Enjoying God and Enjoying Family. I'll link that one in the show notes because that one was so good. It was amazing. Oh, my gosh. It was so good. I loved it. you know, he can be kind of, um, catty is not the right word, but he can kind of, he can be forthright sometimes. And I think that's something along the lines of like, I know you're coming and you want me to give you like X, Y, and Z, like do this, do that, but just enjoy God and enjoy your family. Okay. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for coming on. I'm sure we could have talked for another three hours. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, we'll do this again, I'm sure, another time. I hope you guys enjoyed today's episode. And if you do, reach out, DM me, send me an email. If you loved Bethany, rate it five stars. Tell me and I'll tell Bethany because she was awesome.